Shadowrun Penumbra: Cyberlimb Construction

   The questions come up of what, exactly, makes up a Shadowrun Cyberlimb. One of the players put up their own take on the subject (and thus earned a couple of extra karma points for the contribution), which has led to this – rather longer, if similar – explanation of just what the rules for cyber-replacements and additions really mean.

   The Direct Neural Interface is pretty basic to a cyberlimb. While current basic muscle- and nerve- activity sensor-and-translation systems actually allow some pretty sophisticated operations, Shadowrun goes a bit beyond the current real-world state of the art. Still, in Shadowrun, a “DNI” normally refers to the kind of system you get with a Datajack – an interface with the cerebral cortex and the “conscious levels” of the user’s brain. Links with the deeper levels of the brain normally fall under Hotwiring and Coldwiring. Links with muscular systems, such as are used by vehicle riggers, high-level skillwire systems, exoborgs, neuroborgs, and riggers, are normally handled with Spinal Interfaces – installed below the reflexive and unconscious body-control levels of the medulla oblongata and the upper end of the spinal cord. Oddly enough, such interfaces tend to be extremely essence-intensive, and become even more essence-intensive as more neural channels are diverted. At least in vertebrates, the hindbrain and upper end of the spinal cord seem to be extensively involved in the mind-body-spirit bond – which may be why critters such as shapechangers cannot regenerate damage to that area. Individual limbs can also be run by Peripheral Interfaces, hooked directly to the remainder of the peripheral nerves of the torso or the limb. Such interfaces are less essence-intensive, but cannot report information to the user’s brain except along the usual neural channels for the various components of the senses of touch, kinematics, and related internal senses. If you want to run complex equipment, or have the number of bullets in your cybergun reported to your conscious mind, you’ll want a datajack-style DNI as well as a peripheral or spinal interface. Similarly, using your conscious mind to control muscle-style actions is impossibly clumsy.

  • Technically, all of these systems – Datajacks, Hotwires and Coldwires, Spinal Interfaces, and Peripheral Interfaces are “Direct Neural Interfaces”. In practice, the term is usually restricted to datajack-style connections. It makes for less confusion.
  • While any form of DNI probably should involve a fair amount of circuitry to translate neural signals into electrical or optical control signals for the systems they’re linked to, in Shadowrun this is usually simply subsumed into the interface level regardless of the type of interface installed. At least in Shadowrun, the translation-function is considered minor enough to be installed as a simple transducer implant or as a subcomponent of a datajack or knowsoft link. In practical terms, this is a near-nanite level link structure which serves as a socket and interface for each neural fiber and feeds a minuscule translator-chip.

   The Power Supply doesn’t need to be in the limb itself even in a meat-anchored cyberlimb, but it usually is; running a power cable through the body to a power supply located elsewhere is clumsy, pointless, and dangerous. In general, practical cyberlimb power supplies include some small, high-efficiency, rechargeable power cells and a glucose/oxygen power cell fueled by the user’s blood sugar and blood oxygen and a modest network of power conduits which transfer power to the various subsystems which use it. This allows the user’s normal dietary intake to fuel the cyberlimb or limbs at normal levels, provides extra power for high-level operation, and allows the powercells to be slowly recharged when demands are low. In theory, external chargers might be useful. In practice, people being people, this tends to lead to excessive weight gain or loss from changes in the metabolic load, internal damage from people attempting to overdrive their cyberlimbs or from people plugging in the wrong transformers and circuitry, people trying to use their cyberlimb power supplies for other things under various circumstances, overloaded, damaged, and even detonated batteries, and running out of power at bothersome moments. Most designers skip the external power ports and settle for normal metabolism, normal levels of fatigue, and people needing to eat more after heavy exercise. It simply works out better in the long run. Cyberlimbs do notably reduce the average load on the heart, which is good: increasing the mechanical load on the heart is a good way to kill someone.

  • Cyberlimb systems, such as pairs of legs, or any group of cyberlimbs attached to a cybertorso, may or may not share their power supplies. It depends on whether or not they were designed as a unified system – and, if they were, on how the designers felt about efficiency versus backup options.
  • While there have been discussions of nuclear, magical, rechargeable electrical, and even fuel-driven fuel cell power supplies for cyberlimbs, none of these are even remotely standard systems. This doesn’t mean that some runner with more money than sense may not want to experiment, but it does mean that such things are definitely special-order if they can be obtained at all.

   The Physical Interface, where living tissue meets mechanism, isn’t all that far removed from a classical stump-cap and peg or hook attachment – except that these days it’s surgically attached and anchored in the bones and made of special biologically-inert materials to prevent allergies, rejection, and other complications. Obviously enough, this only matters for attaching cyberlimbs to areas that have not already been cyber-replaced – unless you want such limbs to be easy to remove and either reattach or replace. Enhanced-attribute cyberlimbs involve upgraded physical interfaces, but such costs are fairly negligible compared to the other costs involved. Oddly enough, the essence cost of the Physical Interface is fairly negligible: in itself, it doesn’t have much to do with the central nervous system.

   The “Muscles” of a cyberlimb normally bear little resemblance to those of an organic limb. Unlike muscle “augmentation” and “replacement”, cyberlimb “muscles” are unconstrained by the necessities of comparability with an organic body or self-repair capabilities. Cyberlimbs may thus be designed using electro-contractile fibers, memory-metal systems, hydraulics, electrical motors, spring and polymer “ligaments”, or a bewildering variety of other systems. All of them tend to be a bit less energy-efficient than natural muscle, but – without the necessity of supporting a cellular metabolism, self-repair capabilities, growth mechanisms, immune capabilities, toxin processing, and all the other paraphernalia of a living system, are usually capable of a considerably greater power output. This is why, of course, cyberlimbs are incompatible with muscle augmentation and replacement, but exoborgs and neuroborgs receive substantial bonuses to their basic strength.

   The Structure of a cyberlimb normally includes the internal struts or “skeleton” and may – at least in mechanical-appearing cyberlimbs – be augmented by the limb casing. More natural-appearing cyberlimbs normally use a flexible, non-supportive casing overlaying electrocontractile fibers to provide that “natural” appearance. In game terms making it look natural is basically just a system that takes up a good deal of the available space in a cyberlimb. In practice, the “muscle” layout and general structure of the “skeleton” mimic normal primate anatomy and jointing fairly closely; several million years of evolution have done a fairly good job coming up with an efficient structural design.

   The Casing of mechanical-appearing cyberlimbs is a hard external cover, usually made up of some combination of metals, plastics, and advanced ceramics. While this necessarily involves external jointing to allow movement, such cases may also serve as a part of the limbs structural support – another reason why mechanical-appearing cyberlimbs can mount more equipment and armor than naturally-appearing ones. Naturally-appearing cyberlimbs normally use a polymer cover which flexes over the structural skeleton and contractile-fiber bundles, and can be fairly hard to tell apart from normal limbs. Really expensive cyberlimbs may use cultured and grafted skin, with channels laid in a supporting bioplastic grid for nerves and blood vessels. Such limbs provide natural sensory input, bleed from minor nicks, and can heal from minor damage. On the other hand, they require internal heating systems to prevent “frostbite” in cold weather and can transmit uncomfortable levels of pain. If combined with an internal shielding system, however, they can make cyberlimbs quite difficult to detect, even for a knowledgeable observer.

   The Sensor Systems range from the minimal – standard internal system sensors which can relay their output to a standard DNI or diagnostic system, kinesthetic and positioning feedback, and a simple set of stress monitors and overload warnings – on up through a variety of hypersense enhancers and scientific-quality instruments. If you want touch sensors which can accurately measure weights, temperatures, and angles – or, for that matter, radiation levels, chemical structures, and magnetic fields – such things are available at some expense. Standard mechanical-appearing cyberlimbs provide sensitive sensors only at areas like the fingertips, where they’re required to allow the user to operate normally*. Other areas are limited to the basic feedback sensors necessary for control and basic damage sensors. Naturally-appearing limbs, and those with living skin, normally offer full sensation. If the damage-sensors and stress-sensors are routed to a DNI, you can get detailed readouts. If they’re routed through a peripheral or spinal interface things are normally limited to simulated “aches” and “pains” – although the peak output is usually well below the pain level that can result from damage to a normal limb. A persistent “pain” is – as with a natural limb – a signal that repairs are required.

  • *Otherwise there ought to be penalties for things like picking locks, not being able to tell if something is dangerously hot before touching it, and manipulating small objects in the dark. Since no such penalties are mentioned, at least basic sensors must be provided.
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6 Responses

  1. Cool,
    But i disagree with this partially on two points.
    Physical interface (PI), this has 3 major goals.
    One it’s a mounting point.
    Two it’s the Basic DNI for the Limb.
    And three it’s if the place there the energy interface is most likely.

    DNI has a limited bandwidth, and should thus be upto par with the sensory systems +1, or else induce latency or lag.

    Depending on how the energy gets made or stored this is the place most likely to have the complete system, or when more limbs are used connected to the common power supply.
    However it is rare Cyberarms get installed in a pair Cyberlegs usually are to compensate for uneven quickness.

    Because of that one could nearly vouce for this fact Cyberlegs commonly share power supply cyberarms don’t.
    Still this can not out rule that it would be a option to connect the two and have a thus redundant system.

    Sensory system, anything below limited simsense rig.
    And you don’t know the position your limb is in.
    The system isn’t perfect, and touch isn’t included.

    Touch, this is a delicate system that can be made in two ways.
    Pico electric sensors, and hydraulic, both have their limits.
    Pico electric sensors are useless in a humid area.(sea climate, especially during a hot summer)
    Hydraulic depending on the fluid doesn’t like extreme temperature differences.

    I might have missed a few point i guess, but I think what i said should be pointed out, besides nothing is perfect. ;)

    • “Cool,
      But I disagree with this partially on two points.
      Physical interface (PI), this has 3 major goals.
      One it’s a mounting point.
      Two it’s the Basic DNI for the Limb.
      And three it’s if the place there the energy interface is most likely.”

      The Direct Neural Interface and Energy Interface (if any) are not part of the physical interface as defined, and are discussed in their own sections. Individual limbs normally use Neural Interfaces with the peripheral nervous system, as noted. The physical interface consists of those elements with purely mechanical functions. It’s a purely semantic distinction of course, but it does allow for easier classification and discussion of the various subsystems of a cyberlimb.

      “DNI has a limited bandwidth, and should thus be up to par with the sensory systems +1, or else induce latency or lag.”

      The bandwidth of the peripheral nervous system is actually quite limited. That’s primarily because the transmission speed for neural signals is rather low. To provide some hard data there:

      “Depending on the type of fiber, the neural impulse travels at speed ranging from a sluggish 2 miles per hour to, in some myelinated fibers, a breackneck 200 or more miles per hour. But even this top speed is 3 million times slower than the speed of electricity through a wire.”
      (Myers, David G. Psychology 4th Edition. New York: Worth Publishers Inc, 1995: 43.)

      Secondarily, if just as tellingly, while the number of individual nerve fibers is large, an electronic system can use frequency multiplexing, while a nerve fiber cannot. In practical terms, the “bandwidth” of the nerve impulses in the peripheral nervous system is far lower than that of even a basic DNI system.

      “Depending on how the energy gets made or stored this is the place most likely to have the complete system, or when more limbs are used connected to the common power supply.
      However it is rare Cyberarms get installed in a pair Cyberlegs usually are to compensate for uneven quickness.
      Because of that one could nearly vouce for this fact Cyberlegs commonly share power supply cyberarms don’t.
      Still this can not out rule that it would be a option to connect the two and have a thus redundant system.”

      I’m sorry, but I’m not quite sure what you’re saying here. Perhaps you could clarify a bit?

      “Sensory system, anything below limited simsense rig.
      And you don’t know the position your limb is in.”

      I think you’re referring to the note that a limited simsense rig is a necessary component of a smartgun link here. That is, however, going the other way; you need the limited simsense rig to provide positioning feedback to the electronic targeting system, not to the user’s brain. A simsense rig converts sensory feedback into an electronic format, not the other way around.

      Positioning feedback is necessarily a standard component of a cyberlimb; otherwise normal walking is impossible with a cyberleg and the user would risk clubbing themselves every time they went to scratch their ear with a cyberarm. There is no mention of such hazards or of a separate system requirement in the books. Ergo, positioning feedback must be a standard part of a cyberlimb.

      “The system isn’t perfect, and touch isn’t included.
      Touch, this is a delicate system that can be made in two ways.
      Pico electric sensors, and hydraulic, both have their limits.
      Pico electric sensors are useless in a humid area.(sea climate, especially during a hot summer)
      Hydraulic depending on the fluid doesn’t like extreme temperature differences.”

      The sense of touch actually includes several independent senses – temperature, pressure, and pain (among others).

      Pressure sensors are not even necessary to provide a basic sense of “touch”; the data from positioning sensors coupled with feedback from the power demands of the motor systems will provide some basics.

      Pressure-sensitive systems can, however, be created in a wide variety of ways, including capacitance-sensor systems, fiber-distortion systems, the use of two conductors separated by a compressible dielectric medium, piezoelectric detectors, and many more – all of which can be sealed against moisture quite readily. As noted, at least a limited system of such sensors must be a standard part of cyberlimb design because no penalties are noted for the use of cyberlimbs in situations where such penalties would otherwise be appropriate.

      “I might have missed a few point i guess, but I think what i said should be pointed out, besides nothing is perfect. ;)”

      I agree completely there.

      • The physical interface must allow space for both DNI and the Energy.

        If not the problems that arise can be solve locally by using a battery and making a external connection with the limb by radio or making a connection from the limb to a datajack.
        Quite silly.

        Interfacing man and machine
        Neural fibers need to be interfaced this is a bottleneck, besides i think it has been said but the is a distiction between them.
        that makes not every fiber fit for every type of information.

        like i said nothing is perfect this would include the connection, since your trying to get a interface from on system to another.

        Most systems try and evade the flesh for that reason.
        and thus make a direct Neural interface at the brain and use a medium to go from the brain to the limb.
        They circumvent already existing natural pathways doing so, however those pathways still there bugger you with ghost limb itches.

        Besides multiplexing induces latency since it is an added step.
        A better idea is to mix signals by adding noise signal multiply this should be seen as something like a D/A.C.
        Since a conversion would be needed somewhere else along the line anyhow.
        And don’t tell me a multiplex signal doesn’t

        Energy
        Simply said you can have a local solution or have a generator or a wall plugg for all i care.

        you cyberlimb needs energy/juice to run on.
        In some cases it’s common to have a shared system for instance to reduce cost in both n¥ and essence.
        This is more common where systems are in close proximity to each other and usually installed at the same time.

        So unless the energy gets make in the limb the Physical interface must allow for a manner to get power to the limb.

        Thus that is why the Physical Interface must offer the option for them both unless one is interesting in a rigger hijacking their limb or having the problem of suddenly being without power in the middle of a brawl.

        Sensory systems
        Yes limited simsense rig is needed for a smartlink system, but it is also part of a default cyberlimb, with another interface but the base system is there.

        This well removes the need of someone having to think in manners of Servomotor LL2 needs to run 2 seconds at 600 RPM.
        open valve 3 for 32 milliseconds.
        And makes one free in thinking i like to raise my hand and wave.
        Limited Simsense rig is a feedback loop for positioning, nothing more.
        That is my opinion at least.

        without pressure sensors or contact sensors be prepared to break a lot of glasses and with soft tissue (organic) some friends too.

        positioning and power need to be monitored by the user them self.
        I know for a fact if power requirements rise the motor has been running against something for too long already.

        A controller should reduce the attention need of the limb for the user.
        Letting the alcohol drinking cybered out user, drink from a glass without breaking it in their influenced state.
        Or worse prevent one from risking a injury on a friend. (pulling out of LoS or LoF)
        .

        The reason the book standardized it was to simplify the Bio mechanical knowledge requirements, besides before assembling a Limb let’s just see what a standard limb has to offer and fit that to your need.

        what i I am coming down to is i still don’t agree but this is a matter of opinion i think and the difference in Knowledge skills between us. ;)

  2. “The physical interface must allow space for both DNI and the Energy.”

    Yes. That does not make those systems a part of the physical interface. The frame of a car allows room for the steering system. That does not make the steering system a part of the frame. In any case, this seems to assume that the cyberlimbs power source is external to the cyberlimb, implanted in the user’s body elsewhere, and that a connection routed through the area where the cyberlimb connects with the body is required. The power sources can be in the cyberlimb (easiest and thus most likely), be implanted elsewhere in the user’s body (awkward and pointless), or external (possible, but awkward), and – if the power source is external to the limb – the connection could either be internal to the user’s body (in which case it could be routed through the physical interface or around it under the cosmetic covering) or external. Both are awkward, but fortunately there’s no need for an external power supply anyway.

    “If not the problems that arise can be solve locally by using a battery and making a external connection with the limb by radio or making a connection from the limb to a datajack.
    Quite silly.”

    That is indeed silly. It’s also not a statement that appears in this article.

    “Interfacing man and machine
    Neural fibers need to be interfaced this is a bottleneck, besides i think it has been said but the is a distiction between them. that makes not every fiber fit for every type of information.
    like i said nothing is perfect this would include the connection, since your trying to get a interface from on system to another.”

    Quite true – however, the nerves of the peripheral nervous system are slow, inefficient, and lose a lot of information compared to electronic and optronic systems. It’s not hard even today to greatly exceed the data-transfer efficiency of the peripheral nervous system; the problem lies in creating the links to the individual nerve fibers and in sorting out which fiber should go where. Since Shadowrun has solved this problem – or cyberlimbs would not be possible to begin with – no such bottleneck exists.

    “Most systems try and evade the flesh for that reason.
    and thus make a direct Neural interface at the brain and use a medium to go from the brain to the limb.
    They circumvent already existing natural pathways doing so, however those pathways still there bugger you with ghost limb itches.”

    Phantom Limb Syndrom does indeed result from the misfiring of truncuated nerves in reality (in Shadowrun III it is theorized to result from your aura remembering the lost limb, per Cybertechnology, page 30). However, bypassing the peripheral nervous system and spinal cord to go directly to the motor cortex (that is, “directly to the brain”) involves far more complex neurosurgery that limiting involvement to the peripheral nervous system, requires more installed equipment, creates an extended and easily damaged interface extending through large portions of the body, and is essentially useless; it accomplishes nothing that the existing nerve fibers don’t do

    UNLESS you simply run a fiber-optic link to a datajack so you can get machine-code reports out (something which can be done with a single fiber-optic thread and can be done for free in the game) or want to run devices in the limb with functions which do not mimic a limbs natural functions – in which case that single fiber-optic thread will again do nicely. Just as importantly, the information provided on cyberlimbs does not suggest that they involve bypassing the spine – and neither do the cyberlimb illustrations in Cybertechnology (Sadly, the somewhat-later Man and Machine does not contain similar illustrations). You might want to speed up the user’s reflexes by bypassing the peripheral nervous system, but this causes problems with the brain’s ability to project the results of movements. You can check the articles on Reflex Enhancement for a discussion on that.

    “Besides multiplexing induces latency since it is an added step.
    A better idea is to mix signals by adding noise signal multiply this should be seen as something like a D/A.C.
    Since a conversion would be needed somewhere else along the line anyhow.
    And don’t tell me a multiplex signal doesn’t”

    All you need to do to multiplex electrical signals at different frequencies is to link them across a resistor (If you want to use amplitude modulation you’ll want a diode). In either case, a single component, with signal transmission at near at the speed of light, will do. This will indeed produce latency – in the same amount as having a simple bit of wire or fiber-optic cable. You can’t beat the speed of light. As for “a multiplex signal doesn’t” – doesn’t what?

    “Energy
    Simply said you can have a local solution or have a generator or a wall plugg for all i care.
    you cyberlimb needs energy/juice to run on.
    In some cases it’s common to have a shared system for instance to reduce cost in both n¥ and essence.
    This is more common where systems are in close proximity to each other and usually installed at the same time.”

    Why would a shared power system reduce the cost in nuyen or essence? Shadowrun includes no such adjustment – and there’s no reason to expect it to. Man and Machine defines essence cost as being due to having implanted machines that “talk to the brain”. The power supply for a cyberlimb doesn’t need to talk to the user’s brain – and even if it feeds a readout to a datajacks DNI on how much power is left, that still isn’t the device talking to the user’s brain – it’s talking to the datajack which then talks to the users brain – which is why datajacks have an essence cost. Similarly, Cyberlimbs will often be installed one at a time; even Shadowrunners often want a single replacement leg in which to hide weapons and other systems – or simply because they’ve lost one leg. Normal people will also often want a single replacement leg; that’s why hip surgery often involves only one hip. Now, have you ever looked closely at drive-up ATM pads? They have braille on them. What’s the point of that? Are blind people going to drive up and use them? Obviously not – but the pads are standardized and are used in non-drive-up systems. It’s cheaper to produce them all with braille then it is to produce two varieties. Thus the presumption that the standard cyberlimb design will give each limb it’s own power supply – and special-order systems are usually more expensive.

    “So unless the energy gets make in the limb the Physical interface must allow for a manner to get power to the limb.
    Thus that is why the Physical Interface must offer the option for them both unless one is interesting in a rigger hijacking their limb or having the problem of suddenly being without power in the middle of a brawl.”

    As far as I can tell, this presumes that (1) the Physical Interface is redefined so as to include a power transfer system (which will not exist if the power system is self-contained in normal use), (2) that the Physical Interface is redefined so as to include the neural interface which operates the limb, that (3) if the neural interface is not labeled as part of the physical interface it must therefore be a radio frequency signal that is open to external hacking, and (4) that the presumed external power system is vulnerable to being disconnected. All of those assumptions are either questionable or wrong.

    “Sensory systems
    Yes limited simsense rig is needed for a smartlink system, but it is also part of a default cyberlimb, with another interface but the base system is there.”

    This is flatly wrong. A simsense rig converts the signals from organic nerves into electronic formats. A cyberlimb does not generally have organic nerves in it. I suspect that you are confusing output and input, since simsense signals can be fed back through a standard datajack, and do not require a simsense rig.

    “This well removes the need of someone having to think in manners of Servomotor LL2 needs to run 2 seconds at 600 RPM.
    open valve 3 for 32 milliseconds.
    And makes one free in thinking i like to raise my hand and wave.
    Limited Simsense rig is a feedback loop for positioning, nothing more.
    That is my opinion at least.”

    This is what the motor cortex of the brain is for – and why it is far simpler and easier to use the existing neural network rather than trying to bypass it. You are, however, once again reversing what a simsense rig does however.

    “without pressure sensors or contact sensors be prepared to break a lot of glasses and with soft tissue (organic) some friends too.”

    Yes. This is what the original article says. Thank you for agreeing.

    “positioning and power need to be monitored by the user them self.”

    Yes and no. Position monitoring is known as Kinesthetic Feedback, as noted in the original article. Power is not generally monitored, any more than you actually know how much energy your muscles are currently using. The combination, however, can serve as a limited form of a sense of touch; The force currently being exerted by a system can be determined from it’s energy demand, conversion characteristics, and the rate of change (if any) in its position. This a very simple computation – which could easily be built into a chip in the limb – can determine how much force is being exerted by any given mobile segment of the limb.

    “I know for a fact if power requirements rise the motor has been running against something for too long already.”

    Let us consider a pump motor: when there is nothing to be pumped but air, it will cycle easily. When water is introduced, the power demand will rise sharply, and will continue to rise until the top of the water column reaches it’s maximum pressure in the system, whereupon the power requirement will become nearly steady again. When the water has been pumped and the pressure drops, the power supply will drop again. I’m not quite sure what you’re trying to say, but the statement you actually have made is inaccurate.

    “A controller should reduce the attention need of the limb for the user.
    Letting the alcohol drinking cybered out user, drink from a glass without breaking it in their influenced state.
    Or worse prevent one from risking a injury on a friend. (pulling out of LoS or LoF)”

    Yes. That’s why the peripheral nervous system interface is simplest and – for most operations – best.

    “The reason the book standardized it was to simplify the Bio mechanical knowledge requirements, besides before assembling a Limb let’s just see what a standard limb has to offer and fit that to your need.”

    I’d say because it’s a game. Of course, just as in reality, standardized manufacturing is generally cheaper.

    what i I am coming down to is i still don’t agree but this is a matter of opinion i think and the difference in Knowledge skills between us. ;)

    I do find some of your arguments rather difficult to decipher. Might I suggest composing them with a word processer?

    • If i would use a word processor on it you should learn dutch. ;)

      But okay we agree to disagree on this matter.

      I am still of the opinion that the response time is insufficient.
      for the current (Amps) rise to the needed demand you are already too late since your already against something.
      The has been a interesting test in the first half of the 20th century with what a human body could endure of external force.
      The height of these experiments was a rocket sled on rails.

      Anyhow the body can endure a a give force for a given time.
      Increased force means decreased time.
      to break the average human cranium the force of 400 Newton for a fraction of a second is enough.

      So okay we are fragile and that is a reason to get those goodies we call cyberlimbs.

      So okay, Thoth let’s leave it at this or else we could better co write a book Cyberlimbs the nitty gritty explain in two ways.

      • I’m sorry – but as far as I can tell, there’s nothing relevant and coherent in this comment for me to respond to. It might have something to do with the note on using the power demand versus response to provide a crude sense of touch – but that was a side note on the list of ways to provide a sense of touch anyway and it’s limitations were already noted.

        As far as learning Dutch goes, if I intended to post to a Dutch blog, I would either do so or call on someone who was fluent in Dutch to check my material before posting it. Of course, relevance, expressing complete thoughts, and basic technical information is not language dependent.

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